Says Who?

THE NOZZLE KING OF DENVER

Episode Summary

A literal actual hurricane didn't stop this episode. Unfortunately.

Episode Notes

Maureen is home from the woods. It’s good to be home, back in the familiar place, back in…

Oh. There’s a little tropical storm happening. Nothing to worry about. Dan’s not worried. He’s…he’s rocking back and forth. What’s wrong with Dan? Has he been watching something? Oh. He watched the Axios interview.

Everything seems to be happening at once. It’s August. It’s back to school time, or not. Or possibly? Jared is in charge. Possibly. Sports is happening, or not. No one knows what the hell is going on, least of all Dan. Did you know Maureen can play guitar? Surprise! She can’t. And now Dan is crying again.

Buckle up, SayWhovia. There’s a storm blowing in.

Episode Transcription

Dan:

This.

Maureen:

This.

Dan:

Episode.

Maureen:

Episode.

Dan:

Of.

Maureen:

Of.

Dan:

Says.

Maureen:

Says.

Dan:

Who.

Maureen:

Who.

Dan:

Is brought.

Maureen:

Is brought.

Dan:

To you.

Maureen:

To you.

Dan:

By you.

Maureen:

By you.

Dan:

Through our Patreon, the patreon.com/sayswho. I don't think we should do that, this whole time.

Maureen:

That was good though. No worries.

Dan:

It was great.

Maureen:

It was old.

Dan:

People loved it.

Maureen:

No.

Dan:

But our Patreon, patreon.com/sayswho, where every single fucking Sunday, you get a quarantine special.

Maureen:

Dan, you can't say it like that. You have to be like, "Woo-hoo."

Dan:

Yay.

Maureen:

"Every Sunday of quarantine."

Dan:

"We ultimately are doing a twice weekly show."

Maureen:

"Every Sunday until 2022, you get two episodes a week, if you're a member of our Patreon."

Dan:

Here's a pickle that we have not... Here's a logic loop that we haven't sorted, Maureen. Let's say Trump leaves office, but the quarantine's still happening.

Maureen:

Oof!

Dan:

I don't know what to do there.

Maureen:

I think that we've always said, "When Trump leaves office, we go."

Dan:

Right, but now we've also said that we're doing a Sunday show every Sunday of quarantine.

Maureen:

But what if, something pretty much like Trump, is still in. I mean, Dan, we're just going to be doing this for four more years, aren't we?

Dan:

I don't... Let's not make any hasty promises here.

Maureen:

I mean, Dan.

Dan:

Let's just-

Maureen:

Come on, Dan.

Dan:

Let's just keep going with the ads.

Maureen:

Let's ride this train to 2024.

Dan:

Oh boy, patreon.com/sayswho.

Maureen:

Just kidding, there won't be an internet in 2024.

Dan:

Which is why you need books.

Maureen:

Yes.

Dan:

Look at that, I set you up. I set you up.

Maureen:

Listen.

Dan:

Perfectly.

Maureen:

Listen, listen to me. I've never led you wrong, I've never steered you in the wrong direction, you need books, books will help you, books. And it's not my job to tell you what book to read, but it is my job to write the book for you to read, and then, it's your job to read it. That's right, I've hired you to read my books or, if you don't want, read some other books. But if you read mine, think how happy I'd be, think how happy I'd be, it's like I'm inviting you into my head. I'm like, "Come on in, sit down. It's all good in here and I have a hot casserole, and a glass of ice tea in a fun glass, it's got a picture of baby Yoda on it. And we're going to watch TV while we eat like scumbags. Come on, books." Am I still talking about books?

Dan:

I admit, I spaced out partway through, I think so.

Maureen:

Truly Devious. I mean, it's still available to read for free on Kindle Unlimited, if you have that. It's always free at your library, and you can just get it anywhere else, you can get it. And The Box in the Woods, I'm finishing that now. Also, Dan, around Christmas time, there's going to be a box set.

Dan:

What?

Maureen:

Yes. There's going to be a box set of the Truly Devious books, so all three in a cool box.

Dan:

Wait, does that mean the new one, that you are still writing-

Maureen:

No.

Dan:

... Is coming out before Christmas?

Maureen:

No, it's just that, there are two words that have box, so you'll get the box that will have the actual, Truly Devious story, which is Truly Devious, Vanishing Stair and The Hand on the Wall, all right?

Dan:

Oh. I mean, duh. Duh.

Maureen:

The Box in the Woods, while featuring the same characters, is a new case and is not-

Dan:

God, what a fucking moron I am, Jesus.

Maureen:

Dan, don't beat yourself up.

Dan:

I'm so fucking dupe, so fucking stupid.

Maureen:

Dan. Dan.

Dan:

God damn it. So stupid.

Maureen:

Dan.

Dan:

Just so stupid.

Maureen:

Dan. Dan. It's fine, everybody makes mistakes.

Dan:

God damn it.

Maureen:

Dan, it's okay. Dan, Dan, it's okay, it's all right, everything's fine.

Dan:

Buy books. I really slapped the fuck out of my forehead there, ow!

Maureen:

You should've hit your bottom face, where your beard is.

Dan:

That wouldn't make enough sound, it's all muffled.

Maureen:

Do you feel up your bottom face?

Dan:

Yeah. That's the right word for it.

Maureen:

It's all muscle, your chin is muscle?

Dan:

No, muffled.

Maureen:

Oh muffled.

Dan:

Because there's a big beard there.

Maureen:

I thought you said muscled.

Dan:

I hang weights from my bottom teeth and lift, you don't do that?

Maureen:

Are we still doing a podcast?

Dan:

Who knows? merch.sayswhopodcast.com is where you can buy your Says Who merchandise, like a Do More Doom Less mug, the very mug that I drink coffee out of every morning.

Maureen:

Be like, Dan.

Dan:

Be, like-

Maureen:

Be exactly-

Dan:

Don't do that.

Maureen:

Be exactly like him.

Dan:

But, you can have your coffee in one of the mugs, too, if you go to merch.sayswhopodcast.com. That is M-E-R-C-H, I don't know how else you would spell merch, but in case you wanted to spell it some way or some weird way, you won't get there. But you will if you spell it, M-E-R-C-H.sayswhopodcast.com, we have stuff for you.

Maureen:

Hey, Dan. Dan. It's time to do the podcast, Dan?

Dan:

It seems-

Maureen:

What?

Dan:

It seems windy.

Maureen:

What?

Dan:

Maureen, it seems windy.

Maureen:

No, I'm in the city. I am in the city. Let's do it, podcast.

Dan:

No, it seems... Maureen, it seems-

Maureen:

Have you seen the news today, Dan?

Dan:

There's a hurricane blowing through, right?

Maureen:

Yes.

Dan:

Okay.

Maureen:

There's a hurricane blowing through, so I don't know if you know that, or not.

Dan:

Should we... We want to do this right now, are you okay?

Maureen:

Have you seen the news, today?

Dan:

Yes, yes.

Maureen:

No?

Dan:

No, I said, "Yes."

Maureen:

Yeah, there's a hurricane.

Dan:

Yeah, I know. Are you okay? It sounds really bad.

Maureen:

What?

Dan:

It sounds bad.

Maureen:

Let's do this.

Dan:

I don't know. It sounds-

Maureen:

Dan?

Dan:

Are you there?

Maureen:

Dan, I think we should record now.

Dan:

Okay. Let's do-

Maureen:

I'm going to go outside.

Dan:

No, don't do that.

Maureen:

I'm going to go outside. Bye, Dan. Let's take a deep breath, you ready? Welcome to Says Who, the podcast that isn't a podcast.

Dan:

It's a coping strategy, I am Dan Sinker.

Maureen:

And I'm Maureen Fingers Johnson.

Dan:

What the?

Maureen:

Oof! That's not a good nickname.

Dan:

Gross

Maureen:

I was trying to snippety snap us, Dan. To get us...

Dan:

No.

Maureen:

Because it's been a day of-

Dan:

Sounds gross.

Maureen:

... "Woo-hoo, Fingers Johnson."

Dan:

You are recording from the eye of a hurricane, right now.

Maureen:

I don't know if we're in the eye or if we're in the skirty bit.

Dan:

The skirty bit?

Maureen:

But it was the-

Dan:

That an official term?

Maureen:

It's like there's the swirly-swirly, and then there's the dippy-dippy. And then there's the hook, it's a comma and then there's a little loop at the end.

Dan:

Yeah. And so you're in the loop, right now?

Maureen:

I think the loop is coming.

Dan:

Okay. Man.

Maureen:

We had the, already.

Dan:

That's something, drama, how was it? Is everything standing, is your building intact?

Maureen:

Yeah. I mean, I live in a big concrete tower, so it's pretty sturdy. But all day long was like, "There might be a tornado," so all morning. Dan, do you know how stupid I am, Dan? I woke up this morning and said, "Today, I'm going to get so much work done and nothing will distract me." I said that.

Dan:

That one hurt, that hurt just to hear, ouch!

Maureen:

I know, I've so much to do, Dan.

Dan:

Oof!

Maureen:

And I thought... Here's the weird thing about me, I get a lot done on rainy days than the summer.

Dan:

Uh-Huh (affirmative).

Maureen:

The sunny days take it out of me, they just really grind me down, but I was-

Dan:

It sounds like a ballad, a ballad from the '70s.

Maureen:

Rare synergies, they really grind me. I'm going to get a guitar.

Dan:

Just in general or right now?

Maureen:

I'm going to get one right now.

Dan:

Oh no.

Maureen:

Hold on.

Dan:

Oh boy.

Maureen:

Hold on.

Dan:

Oh, no.

Maureen:

I'm going to go get a guitar. Got it, here we go.

Dan:

All right.

Maureen:

All right, let's see here, Dan. Dusty. Strap on. Here we go.

Dan:

Oh boy.

Maureen:

Here we go.

Dan:

It's very exciting.

Maureen:

Got the strap on all right. I got a couple of guitars in this house, Dan.

Dan:

Damn.

Maureen:

I got an electric one, we got an acoustic.

Dan:

That's just a whole band.

Maureen:

I think we have two acoustic. All right, here we go. What was the song called?

Dan:

To grind in the summertime or something, I forget now.

Maureen:

I'm going to sing something about a hurricane, here we go.

Maureen:

(Singing).

Dan:

You wouldn't know.

Maureen:

(Singing).

Maureen:

I'm making guitar noises, you wouldn't...

Dan:

There'd be no way to know that you don't know how to play it.

Maureen:

That sounds like something.

Dan:

It just sounds good. It sounds great, sounds good.

Maureen:

All right. That's-

Dan:

Well, Maureen-

Maureen:

I really-

Dan:

... You managed to come back from the woods, just in time for this hurricane.

Maureen:

Where I was, the other day, was under a tornado watch. I think, was it last night or the night before? That they were actually having to hide in their basements?

Dan:

Oof!

Maureen:

Yeah. A tornado, I think, touched down not too far, but all my friends were all okay but a couple of them were hiding in the basement. Do you like acoustic guitar music, Dan? Fuck you.

Dan:

Yeah, I do.

Maureen:

Do you?

Dan:

I'm a fucking sad sandwich of a music liker so, yeah.

Maureen:

Wow.

Dan:

Totally.

Maureen:

That amazes me.

Dan:

Really? Why?

Maureen:

Because you're the editor of Punk Planet.

Dan:

We talked to Elliot Smith back in the day, come on.

Maureen:

Did you?

Dan:

Oh yeah.

Maureen:

I mean, everybody likes Elliot Smith.

Dan:

There you go.

Maureen:

But I played the piano as a kid, that's what I played.

Dan:

Did you?

Maureen:

Yes, I did.

Dan:

I played the piano as a kid, I did not enjoy the piano at all, I was forced. Torture, piano lessons were, didn't like it.

Maureen:

I have no natural aptitude for the piano or any instrument, just none.

Dan:

You wouldn't know, hearing you play that guitar, you would not know.

Maureen:

God damn it, Dan.

Maureen:

(Singing).

Dan:

Oh no.

Maureen:

(Singing).

Dan:

This is how the whole episode is going to go, isn't it?

Maureen:

Oh, I can see the power that they feel, holding this piece of shit, but it's just not good. I hate acoustic guitar music, I hate it, I hate it.

Dan:

All right. Well that's-

Maureen:

With only a couple exceptions.

Dan:

Okay. Well, let's move on.

Maureen:

But, I like it if it's electric guitar, big, hairy, stinky music.

Dan:

All right.

Maureen:

You know what I mean? I like stinky music, hairy, stinky. I like that.

Dan:

Okay.

Maureen:

That's me.

Dan:

It's good. Well, Maureen Johnson.

Maureen:

I have an OoberSwank update.

Dan:

Oh boy.

Maureen:

Yep, I'm wearing one right now, Dan.

Dan:

Do you? Yeah?

Maureen:

Wearing one of my OoberSwank drop crutch jumpsuits, right now. Now, you had given me a link to maybe order a couple more, and I did order from the link you sent me, Dan. I think the first clue that maybe they weren't going to be the full OoberSwank quality is that, they were $6 and 50 cents each, and they took two and a half months to arrive.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

But they did get here and they're OoberSwank adjacent, but they feel very flammable. They are squeaky and they remind me of the material that my uniform was made out of, at my high school, which-

Dan:

Oh, nice.

Maureen:

The way I described this material is that... Here's a trick I used to do at lunchtime, I would take a full cup of water and pour it into my own lap, and then brush it away, and it was dry. This was my favorite thing to do, that thing could not be destroyed. I saw people trying to burn that thing and it didn't burn, I don't know why but it-

Dan:

Maybe it just passed out from the fumes.

Maureen:

Oh, this thing was indestructible.

Dan:

One of my favorite things about ordering weird shit from overseas, right now, because we truly live in a golden age of that, is that you literally never have an idea of what the material will be, when it shows up. I got this very off-putting combination, mask, visor, and bonnet, it truly looks like it is from some weird Amish, future cult. And it is made... but the material, it is like literally the material that you would make a tent out of.

Maureen:

Oof!

Dan:

And if you were to wear... I can't imagine if you were to wear it on a hot day, which is what the whole point of it is, to be masked and face shielded and shielded from the hot, hot sun, I think you would pass out in mere moments. You're basically just wearing-

Maureen:

I just ordered one of those, and I got it off of Etsy, from a woman who makes them. I think it-

Dan:

Oh yeah, that one you got looks amazing.

Maureen:

That's the one I just ordered.

Dan:

Yeah, that one looks good.

Maureen:

It was more pricey. Now, with shipping and everything, it was $70.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

Now here's the deal with that though, first of all, you look like the fucking Mandalorian in this. It's so-

Dan:

Yeah, that thing's incredible.

Maureen:

It looks good. But also, I feel like $70 is a pretty good investment for what's going to be, I think, a fairly long season.

Dan:

Fairly long Mandalorian season?

Maureen:

Honestly, I would wear that thing just on a windy day in New York, in the winter, when everything's that... Cold is just blown into your face, we just never had a thing for that. But now, I basically have a windshield for my face, you put it on it looks like a backpack. It has a upper body harness, so it goes around your arm, you clip it in, and then it's this big Stevie Nicks Welsh witch hood. And then a internal face puller-up, a little internal snood thing. And then this giant mask that goes... It looks so badass.

Dan:

It is really good. Will it be perfect?

Maureen:

We're going to be doing this all, all winter, aren't we?

Dan:

We are. But, Maureen Johnson, this is the thing that I want to talk about right now, I don't want to talk about the winter yet, I want to talk about the fact that suddenly it is August.

Maureen:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Dan:

And this is what I don't get, and I hope you can help me figure this out.

Maureen:

Sure.

Dan:

Why is the fact that it's August feel like so much more of a punch in the gut, than when it was suddenly and mysteriously April or May or June or July? August, when it turned August, it was like, "What the fuck is happening?"

Maureen:

I think I know the answer. I think I know. All right. So, when we locked down it was March. So, March is the the tail end of spring, or it's... No, I'm sorry, it's the beginning of spring, the tail end of winter. And we were going... So it was about halfway through March that we locked down, so we were already going into a season. So when April came, it was like, "Okay, we have a new month and we've been doing this for two to three weeks, what chumps we are, we'll go three weeks and it's... " And then it was April and May and it was still the same season, and then that line between spring and summer is very slippy, so it's hard to tell when it's officially summer because one day it's just real hot and then it's summer.

Maureen:

And we never really... And the schools had closed down already, so everyone was already home. So we weren't going anywhere, everybody was already home from school and everyone was like, "Who even knows?" So now, August is the armpit of summer, I mean, in New York it just stinks, it's so fucking hot.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

The other day I had to walk somewhere and it was so hot, Dan, that all my clothes... It was like my clothes had shrink-wrapped to my body, everything was like, and they fit in my mouth.

Dan:

Were you wearing one of the plastic OoberSwanks, right then?

Maureen:

No. Dan, you don't wear that, it'll melt, that will become a fuse with my skin. So my mask was suctioned to my face, ugh, it was grim and there was no shade anywhere, it was just sun and it just boils in the city, everything smells like hot garbage. Summer in New York, August in New York, is always the month where I was like, "Well, this is bullshit." Every August that I have lived here, and I have lived here a long time, I'm like, "This is bullshit."

Maureen:

So the thing about August is that because there was no delineation between the spring, the summer, kids coming out... Leaving their school year, none of those rituals were observed, we just slid into summer like we were on a log flume of shit. We were just, and now August is that very important transitional month where everyone's like, "Summer," and it gets super hot and you cannot mistake it for anything except summer, because everything is a billion, billion degrees and it stinks and it's hot all the time, and then hurricanes come and then every... It's that lead up.

Maureen:

Even if you're not in school or have anybody that's going to school, it's that feeling of transition that's coming like, "Everyone is going to go back to school, and we're going to stop doing these summer things soon, in a couple... " Well, not soon, "In a couple of weeks, we'll stop doing the summer stuff and we'll put away all of our shorts and our paddleboards, and our motor boats or jet skis or whatever the shit you do in the summer, you put that away and then you get pencils and pens, it's going to get cool, we're at pumpkin spice lattes." It's going to be a transition, but there is no transition.

Maureen:

I think one of the biggest transitions of the year is August to September. And this year there was no transition and now we're facing this thing where, when you jumped from summer into fall, and we're nowhere near that yet. But when you make that jump, you always feel it, everybody feels it. But this year, who even knows? Because your kids aren't going to school.

Dan:

Duh, no.

Maureen:

Lots of people's kids aren't going to school. Or, more frighteningly, some people's kids are going to school or they're partially going to school, or they don't know whether or not they're... A lot of people I know are like, "I have no clue if my kid is going to school," or, "My kid might be going to school two days a week, and then that will last for three weeks and then they will be home." And it's, I think, that sign that we have just been inside for a long time and there's no end in sight.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

I feel better, you feel better?

Dan:

I think you hit the nail on the head there. I don't, weirdly having it put so good concretely actually makes me feel worse.

Maureen:

Right. Right.

Dan:

So that's great.

Maureen:

I've got-

Dan:

That's great.

Maureen:

I've got a mixed... So various things I've heard from friends, either kids like yours just not going back, or a couple places they're doing a hybrid. I think the hybrids confused me most of all.

Dan:

Oh without a doubt.

Maureen:

It's the worst of our hordes.

Dan:

Yes. Yeah. The hybrid helps no one.

Maureen:

Yeah.

Dan:

At all.

Maureen:

I mean, sure, it's going to reduce some classroom congestion, basically once they're in, they're in. Once you've exposed-

Dan:

But it doesn't... It doesn't help working parents.

Maureen:

No.

Dan:

Because if your kid is only going one day a week or something like that, they are mostly home. It does not help teachers because all they're doing is having more kids cycling through, it doesn't help the kids because, good God, and I hate the hybrid model the most. Well, that's not true, I hate the, "Let's just go back to school and pretend like nothing ever happened," the most, but the hybrid model is a strong second.

Maureen:

I don't know of anyone that I know, and I'm sure it's going on, I just meant that I don't have any friends that I know of that they're just going back to school model.

Dan:

I don't know anyone close, but I do know some folks in Iowa that they seem to be rapidly moving toward that. There are definitely places where it is happening, and there are places where it has already started, that's the wildest thing. Is that schools have already gone back to session, Indiana schools have already started and there are at least two schools that, day one, they had COVID cases. Because kids had taken tests prior to school, the tests had not come back yet, they went to school anyway and then, weird, they came back positive.

Maureen:

Yes, there was also... So there were places that immediately shut down or there's Gwinnett County, I think in Georgia, the largest school district in the state, reported Sunday, that 260 employees have tested positive for the coronavirus or are in quarantine because of possible exposure, as they prepare for the new school year, and that's from the Atlanta News Now site.

Dan:

Perfect.

Maureen:

And there was a photo circulating today, that now I feel like everybody's probably seen it, of a a very, very crowded hallway.

Dan:

Yeah, I saw that.

Maureen:

In a high school in Georgia. And so it's absolutely rammed because that's what high school hallways are like, they're just rammed, and some people were wearing masks and some weren't. Because, you know what I thought when I looked at that photo, Dan? I remembered being a teenager in my indestructible uniform. And all I wanted to do was deface that thing and not follow the rules, it was my reason for being.

Maureen:

And if they said, "Pull your socks up," I pulled them down. If they said, "You can wear them down, I pulled them up." So if someone's like, "You have to wear a mask," not being an asshole, I would probably have worn the mask because I'd be like... Because the politics. But there's that impulse, as a teenager, to be like, "I'm taking my fucking mask off," not because you're a jerk, but because it's your impulse, everything in you is saying, "Stick it to the man."

Maureen:

So there's going to be a lot of kids that are like, "I'm not going to wear this mask." And little kids aren't going to be able to wear those masks all day.

Dan:

No.

Maureen:

And that's so much to... Although I will say, yesterday, I was walking down on our big old sidewalks here, and there was a little girl and she had on a mask and a helmet, and a face shield. And she was on a trike, a little big wheel looking thing. And she was just ripping down the sidewalk going, "Superwoman," and I was so into it.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

She was just like doing it, she had every safety thing on her head and she was like, "I'm going to fuck some shit up." I'm for and I am loving it.

Dan:

That is awesome. Our five-year-old is always very excited when we go out, because he attempts to choose from his mask selection, a mask that will match with one of us.

Maureen:

Oh.

Dan:

And is always very excited when he's got a mask option that's a matcher.

Maureen:

He's a lovely kid.

Dan:

He is.

Maureen:

He's a real little potato.

Dan:

He is, he is a potato of a child, that is for certain. But Maureen Johnson, August does not just mean this weird, almost back to school, what the fuck is school? Moment. But also, is the start of... No, sorry, I just got confused. All right, sorry, Maureen, are you there?

Maureen:

Yep, I'm here right.

Dan:

Okay. All right.

Maureen:

Dan, I'm here.

Dan:

August does not just mean this weird fucking school, not school, what the fuck's school? Shit, this is.

Maureen:

(Singing).

Dan:

Oh, no. Okay.

Maureen:

That's it.

Dan:

It also means that the unemployment benefits that were added by Congress, at the beginning of the pandemic, to give anyone on unemployment an extra $600 bucks a week has run out. You would think they could pull their shit together, to not have made that happen, but congressional Republicans were at an impasse because many of them didn't want to do it at all. Because, as they claim, they don't want to pay people more money than they would make if they were working, which seems more like a, "We're not paying people enough to work," problem than unemployment insurance problem.

Dan:

And other ones wanted to reduce the $600 a week to $200 a week, and then they just ran out of time. So that fucking sucks, it's not good, it's not good. Suddenly tens of millions of dollars... Sorry, suddenly tens of millions of people are about to lose money that was keeping them afloat, which means there's going to be ripple effects around rent and mortgage, and already stressed food banks. And it's not great, and certainly if you are a Says Who listener, who this is affecting, our heart goes out to you.

Maureen:

I don't even have the words for it, Dan.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

I am incredibly lucky that I have a job that hasn't been affected by this.

Dan:

Strange.

Maureen:

And that offers job wasn't. And really, all money is for, at this point, is for giving away.

Dan:

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it is just fucking-

Maureen:

Because we're-

Dan:

... It is unconscionable.

Maureen:

What's happening here in New York is that, just very few... There's so many people that aren't going to be able to pay their rent, and haven't been able to pay their rent. And there's been no rent freeze, there was a temporary thing but then they were like, "You pay it later," nobody has any money.

Dan:

No.

Maureen:

And a lot of businesses, I think they're estimating something like a third-

Dan:

Yeah, I just saw that.

Maureen:

... Of small businesses in New York will go down permanently. The permanent closures that we see around here are constant, constant. You just walked down the street, it's like, "Closed, closed, for rent, closed, closed."

Dan:

Yeah, it is fucking insane that this did not come together and it's no good. But Ivanka Trump, Maureen Johnson, has a solution because just before benefits ran out, she launched a new ad campaign called and I quote, "Find something new."

Maureen:

I hate them, Dan, and I don't want to hate anybody, because it's not good for you to hate.

Dan:

Seems fine.

Maureen:

I hate them so much.

Dan:

Yes. Yeah. That seems correct.

Maureen:

So she's going to learn a new skill? As a?

Dan:

She's not. She just thinks that other people should, I quote, "As a result of COVID, people need to, in some cases, learn a completely new skill."

Maureen:

Is she going to get a second skill aside from being born rich or?

Dan:

No. She doesn't need to, she's fine.

Maureen:

That skill tends to hold up, being born rich really usually works out.

Dan:

Yeah. She seems to have done that, succeeded at that, for sure. Just with flying colors, great success.

Maureen:

But they have been doing a great job, they have been doing a great job, you have to work that.

Dan:

They have. In fact, just this week, Vanity Fair had a story clearly shopped by their publicist, at least to start, explaining that Jared had basically created an entire national testing policy and plan, back in the spring, but then it never came together, but that he had it all sorted.

Dan:

According to Vanity Fair, "Inside the White House, over much of March and early April, Kushner's handpicked group of young business associates, which included a former college roommate, teamed up with several top experts from the diagnostic testing industry, together they hammered out the outline of a national testing strategy. The group, working night and day, using the encrypted platform, WhatsApp, emerged with a detailed plan obtained by Vanity Fair."

Dan:

So I know this is a secondary thing, but I would like to point out the Jared has already been dinged, last year, about using WhatsApp for government business but that's not an issue, apparently. Maureen, what was the plan quote? "Rather than have states fight each other for scarce diagnostic tests and limited lab capacity, the plan would have set up a system of national oversight and coordination to serve supplies, allocate test kits, lift regulatory and contractual roadblocks, and establish a widespread virus surveillance system by the fall, to help pinpoint subsequent outbreaks."

Dan:

I mean, yes, that's the right plan. Literally, that's the plan that anyone that you would have talked to that wasn't Jared Kushner, over the last few months, would have said, "That is what a national plan should look like."

Maureen:

I genuinely think a child could come up with that.

Dan:

I mean, basically the plan is, "Let's have a plan," right?

Maureen:

The plan is, "We should probably have some stuff."

Dan:

Yeah, "We should probably coordinate."

Maureen:

"Let's have stuff."

Dan:

"Instead of just making it fucking thunder dome," I don't know. But no national coordinator testing plan ever was announced, the plan, according to Vanity Fair, quote, "Just went poof into thin air."

Maureen:

It's almost like they got Jared Kushner to handle it.

Dan:

All most, right? The big issue, as cited in the article, is that, quote, "The effort ran headlong into shifting sentiment at the White House, trusting his vaunted political instincts," vaunted? "President Trump had been downplaying concerns about the virus, and spreading misinformation about it, efforts that were soon amplified by Republican-elected officials and right wing media figures. Worried about the stock market and his reelection prospects, Trump also feared that more testing would only lead to higher case counts and more bad publicity." I haven't heard that recently.

Dan:

"Most troubling of all perhaps was a sentiment the expert said a member of Kushner's team expressed, because the virus had hit blue states hardest, the national plan was unnecessary and would not make sense politically. The political folks believe that because it was going to be relegated to democratic states, that they could blame those governors and that would be an effective political strategy."

Maureen:

I got to go. I'm going to go now, Dan, I'm going to go. I have to go anywhere, out to see maybe. I think I'm going to go out to see.

Dan:

Sounds right.

Maureen:

I think that if I went out to see today, I could get pretty far.

Dan:

Yeah. The sea's really moving.

Maureen:

I could just go and go and go and just go away, and just keep... Dan, I'm just... Dan.

Dan:

It's not great. It's not great.

Maureen:

But somebody has to have a plan right now.

Dan:

Yes. Maureen Johnson, sports has plans.

Maureen:

Okay, sports has plans.

Dan:

Major League Baseball is doing a lot of testing. And the funny thing is, their baseball players keep testing positive. There are now, I believe the Florida Marlins and the St. Louis Cardinals are both sitting out for extensive periods of time, because of outbreaks on their team. Players are dropping out because they are realizing that they don't want to-

Maureen:

Die.

Dan:

... Be in this fucking shit show, that has been created. Football is starting to get back to practice, and they are going to adopt a similar plan to Major League Baseball, which is basically, "Fuck it," I guess, that seems to be the main point of the plan. The Denver Broncos yesterday tweeted out a video of their players, and it said, "Back to work, but first sanitize." And it was their players all walking out in uniforms, and then walking under some gentle mist spray that sprayed down on them.

Maureen:

Wait what?

Dan:

Yeah, yeah. And then a spokesperson from the team said that they were being sprayed with, "nanocrystalline structures."

Maureen:

What?

Dan:

Yes. So they are getting-

Maureen:

They're being sprayed with nanocrystalline structures?

Dan:

Yeah, to protect them against the virus. I can't quite emphasize how much of a gentle mist, the gentle mist was, that they walked underneath. And I don't know what the fucking nanocrystalline structure is, but I'm pretty sure that they got sold. Somebody from the Denver Broncos brother-in-law, is the nozzle King of Denver or something. And was like, "What you need here, I can hook you up with a nozzle and they can walk under this thing, and it'll look like they're doing good."

Maureen:

Side note to Dan, a 100% this is called The Nozzle King of Denver.

Dan:

Oh, Maureen.

Maureen:

Dan.

Dan:

I'm fucking broken record on this, but if sports teams... I believe the figure is that Major League Baseball made something like $11 billion last year, or something. If they can't keep COVID out, our schools are not going to keep COVID out. And it makes me so fucking mad, it makes me very mad, it makes me very mad boy.

Maureen:

Dan, we got to get your mind off this.

Dan:

Well, fine. We can because we have a fund plan here, because meanwhile, COVID deaths are increasing rapidly, cases continue to accumulate in staggering numbers. And thusly, the president or somebody close to him, decided to do an interview with Washington insider press outlet, Axios. Which, Maureen, brings us to today's installment of Says Who strip piece theater. Playing the role of Axios' Jonathan Swan is... Maureen, I can't. I can't do it. I can't do it.

Maureen:

Dan we got to do it. Dan.

Dan:

I fucking... I can't do it.

Maureen:

Dan. Dan.

Dan:

I watched this fucking interview this morning, it is 37 minutes long. I spent a good 25 minutes just staring off into middle space afterwards, and have felt like death ever since, I cannot, I cannot.

Maureen:

We have to.

Dan:

I cannot do this as a theater.

Maureen:

I haven't seen it.

Dan:

I will tell you about it.

Maureen:

I saw bits of it. I saw bits of it.

Dan:

I can't reenacted it because it's like I would be reenacting my fucking death.

Maureen:

Dan, I saw parts of it.

Dan:

It's not good.

Maureen:

And you know what I said? I said, "I don't want that." So I don't want it.

Dan:

I saw parts of it and I thought, "I should watch the whole thing," and you know what? I have regrets.

Maureen:

Can you at least tell me about it?

Dan:

I can. So, on the-

Maureen:

Is it going to upset me?

Dan:

Yes.

Maureen:

Okay.

Dan:

On the positive, it is one of the rare moments that a journalist calls Trump on his shit. Just over and over and over, Trump will say something outlandish, like for instance, telling Jonathan Swan that after explaining that too many tests is not good, and Swan says something like, "Well, why would that be?" And Trump tells him to, "Read the manual and you would know," and Swan then says, "What manual?" And he goes, "Well, books, read the books." And he's like, "Well, what books?" And then Trump starts stammering and moves on, just over and over and over again.

Dan:

And the first 48 seconds, when that happens, you're like, "This is great." And then it just keeps going and going and going, and the whole thing is such a fucking stark, ass reminder of how no fucking body at all, is at the wheel here. Just, it's grim, Maureen.

Maureen:

Dan, maybe we-

Dan:

It is a grim listen.

Maureen:

Maybe we shouldn't do this, Dan.

Dan:

Well, I'm not, I'm not, but it's just-

Maureen:

I mean, not even talk about, Dan.

Dan:

Every time he fucking starts answering, his voice, the stammer, as soon as he's called out his voice raises up like an octave or two. When asked-

Maureen:

Does he seem flustered at all? Does he seem like he's-

Dan:

Oh, constantly.

Maureen:

... Aware that he's not getting away with it.

Dan:

He just seems annoyed. He's flustered and annoyed. It is a real performance by somebody that is never, ever, ever called out. Because this is... So Swan is an Australian reporter for Axios, Axios is a very insider-

Maureen:

Insidery. Yeah, I was amazed that they were doing it.

Dan:

Super insidery. Well, it's access journalism times a thousand, right? And so he's very polite the whole time, he's not particularly confrontational, he has that disarming Australian-British type of demeanor. He doesn't ever get flustered, there's a lot of shots of him bugging his eyes out, it's like that, "What? What am I hearing? My, My," thing going on.

Maureen:

What was that?

Dan:

I don't know. I don't know. I don't know, but this was recorded a week ago so Congressman John Lewis was laying in state, in Congress, when they recorded, Trump did not fucking go. And he's asked what he thinks of John Lewis and he basically is just like, "Well, he didn't attend my inauguration so I don't know him, I don't care about him." He's asked how history will think about John Lewis? And he's like, "Well, a lot of people were involved in the civil rights movement." He goes on to explain that he has done more for Black people in this country than any president, to which Swan just repeatedly is like, "But Lyndon Johnson passed the civil rights act."

Dan:

There's a moment, a minute-long loop of Swan just being like, "But Lyndon Johnson, but the civil rights act." And Trump just goes, "Well, we know how that worked out," which I don't know what that means.

Maureen:

I don't think that means anything.

Dan:

Yeah. I don't know what that means. He's asked about Russia paying bounties on U.S. troops in Afghanistan, and supplying arms to the Taliban, and Trump counters by explaining that the U.S. used to supply arms to the Taliban, which doesn't seem like the right answer, but who am I? But the clip that has been passed around the most is when asked about COVID deaths, Trump brings out a series of charts that he stammers his way through, because he wants to keep explaining that we're doing really well with deaths. And the charts that he brings out, are deaths in relation to the number of cases we have.

Dan:

And so we are very low in that ranking because we have a lot of cases, and then we have a lower number of deaths, especially the charts that they were doing, and so the ratio of those things is a very high ratio. He, at one point, walks through the chart and he's like, "Well, we're lower than Germany, we're lower than China, we're lower than the world," which I don't know what that means.

Maureen:

What?

Dan:

Yeah. We're lower, we have less-

Maureen:

Dan, I don't feel good.

Dan:

... COVID deaths than the world.

Maureen:

I don't feel good now that you're telling, I don't like it, I don't like this.

Dan:

But then the weirdest thing to me, because-

Maureen:

I don't want to hear what it is, Dan.

Dan:

... Even though I should know better, Maureen, and I know-

Maureen:

I don't like this.

Dan:

... That I should not expect consistency or logic-

Maureen:

I feel like I want to, [crosstalk 00:46:57].

Dan:

Or anything, but here's a guy who's talking about measuring-

Maureen:

I don't like this

Dan:

... That the only measure that counts, because literally Swan, repeatedly, is like, "But our deaths to population is really bad, and that feels like a more relevant number." And he's like, "No, it's deaths to cases, that's the number you have to pay attention to."

Maureen:

All right. Wait. Hold on.

Dan:

But then he-

Maureen:

Slow down. Slow down.

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

So Jonathan Swan says, "Deaths to population is the number?"

Dan:

Yeah. Meaning-

Maureen:

And then Trump says?

Dan:

And Trump says, "No, that's not the number. The number that you should look at is deaths in relation to cases."

Maureen:

Is deaths. Right. Got you. Following.

Dan:

Which doesn't make a lot of sense since Trump's whole fucking thing, is that the reason we have so many cases is because we test so much.

Maureen:

Right.

Dan:

And that the reason that other countries don't have a lot of cases is because, they test so little. But if you use that, if you follow his logic and say, "Let's test half as many people and, thusly, we will return some number of less cases," then our ratio of deaths to cases will be a lot worse. And if Germany tested more people, then their deaths to case ratio would be a lot better. That's just not-

Maureen:

No. It's just not how anything would... Also, do you know how many people are just... There's the Trump relative that is actually getting on board with all this, because I constantly disabuse him of notions.

Dan:

Yes.

Maureen:

If he says things like, "we test more than anywhere."

Dan:

You mean a relative of yours?

Maureen:

Yes. Some relative.

Dan:

You don't mean a relative of Trump's.

Maureen:

No.

Dan:

Yes.

Maureen:

No, I wouldn't like that at all.

Dan:

No.

Maureen:

I've got Eric here, Dan.

Dan:

Okay. Sorry. I just wanted to clarify that.

Maureen:

Someone started to feed that boy, Trump administration was-

Dan:

So your Trump-supporting relative has come what?

Maureen:

Well, I am constantly disabusing them, they say things like, "We test more than anywhere," and I say, "Nope," and they say, "Things are going down," and I say, "Nope." And they have to listen, because it turns out these things are simply true. Now, I know you can say that of other things, but I think this person is worried that I might die, because I lived in a place that terrible things happened and I saw things.

Maureen:

So I was able to say, "Here are some things I saw," and they listen. And I think they understand, and I'm watching that disconnect, that cognitive dissonance of them trying to hold these two ideas at the same time, that they like Trump and also all of these things are not true. And I'm watching that confusion happen, that little, "I'm squeezing my fingers together like I'm squishing something, and I'm stretching them out." I'm just watching that little opening and closing where they're just trying to figure out how to deal with this. And I don't know what they... Damn it, I hate everything now.

Dan:

Yeah. Yeah. And you didn't even spend 37 minutes watching it.

Maureen:

I watched five minutes of it and then I was really sad.

Dan:

Yeah, it's not good.

Maureen:

And then I was like, "I'm just going to make sure we're not going to have a tornado."

Dan:

It's better, Tornado sounds better. Tornado sounds.

Maureen:

Dan, I feel like we're going to bring people back up and nothing brings people up like a little music.

Dan:

Oh, no.

Maureen:

(Singing).

Maureen:

Oh, I think I accidentally played the chord.

Dan:

Did you just announce that you were changing a cord?

Maureen:

Yeah.

Dan:

Okay.

Maureen:

But I don't know how to play any chords.

Dan:

Yeah, I was wondering that.

Maureen:

So I just put my fingers in a different-

Dan:

In a different spot.

Maureen:

I put my fingers in different places.

Dan:

Okay. That's-

Maureen:

Do you play guitar?

Dan:

I used to play a lot of guitar back when I was in high school, I played a lot of guitar, but I do not and I have not in a very long time.

Maureen:

I don't understand it, it seems so weird to me. The whole fretboard thing is very confusing, I mean, you wouldn't... That's probably going to surprise you considering how I just played, but I really do not understand it.

Dan:

Man, you wouldn't know, you're a natural.

Maureen:

I am.

Dan:

You are just a natural.

Maureen:

I just pick it up and go, and I just have a gift.

Dan:

You're on it. You're good. You're good. You know what else is good, Maureen?

Maureen:

What?

Dan:

Our Patreon backers, who make all of this possible through their support of our Patreon at patreon.com/sayswho, Our Patreon, where every Sunday of course quarantine, you get a special quarantine Sunday edition of Says Who Podcast, that's a thing we do.

Maureen:

It's a lot, and it's-

Dan:

Every week.

Maureen:

Dan.

Dan:

We do that, it's good, it's Smart, it's good.

Maureen:

Remember when you had that idea, Dan?

Dan:

Was it me?

Maureen:

Yes.

Dan:

Well, you were the one that was like, "That sounds great." I think you responded, "All caps, yes."

Maureen:

Dan, did I?

Dan:

I think so.

Maureen:

Dan?

Dan:

It sounds like you, what?

Maureen:

How many did you think we were going to make?

Dan:

Like 10.

Maureen:

Like 10?

Dan:

On the outside? Like six, seven, I don't know.

Maureen:

Right. You thought we were going to get out of that by what? July?

Dan:

I mean I didn't really, that's the thing that's funny.

Maureen:

It is funny.

Dan:

Is like I didn't.

Maureen:

You didn't think that at all.

Dan:

It just seemed like there would be some change that then would give us an easy to like, "That's done, look at that."

Maureen:

It's going to be so fun when we're doing our Christmas bonus episode. And you know what you're going to say to me? Hold on, I'm going to do a couple of predicting things, ready?

Dan:

Yeah.

Maureen:

Beginning of September, "How fuck is it September, now? Oh my God." October, "How the fuck is it October, now? Oh my God." November, "How the fuck is it November, now? Oh my God? I can't believe it's November, Oh my God, I'm going to be 40 in a couple of days. Oh my God, 40 years ago we were never supposed to be here and now here we are, oh my God, it's November. Oh my God it's December, we still don't have a result over the election, oh my God, oh my God. Oh my God it's the end of December, it's the end of 2020, oh my God, how are we still doing this, we still don't have a result of the election. Oh my God it's January, oh my God."

Dan:

I got faint hearing this.

Maureen:

"We still don't know who's going to be inaugurated, oh no, we're still doing this. How are we still doing this? We've made 50 brilliant extra episodes, oh my God. Oh, Maureen, you know what we should do? We should do a third episode a week, just until we get a result of the election, how about an election bonus? Let's do an election bonus Maureen. Oh my God, it's the end of 2021 and we're still doing election bonuses, we're doing three episodes a week, oh my god."

Dan:

I had to sit down. I had to sit down.

Maureen:

I could have kept going, but I-

Dan:

I'm so dizzy.

Maureen:

Yeah.

Dan:

Oh, that was a real don't cross the stream situation there.

Maureen:

You saw a dizzying tunnel in front you, didn't you?

Dan:

I did.

Maureen:

Totally in this-

Dan:

I did, I saw my future so clearly laid out in front of me, and I did not like what I saw.

Maureen:

Mm-mm (negative).

Dan:

Oh.

Maureen:

"Oh my God."

Dan:

I'm sitting down, I always record these episodes standing up.

Maureen:

Honestly, Dan, when do you think-

Dan:

And I'm sitting down right now and I don't know why I haven't done this before.

Maureen:

It's pretty... Just sit down, Dan.

Dan:

I don't know why I can't.

Maureen:

You can't be standing, you're in no condition to be standing, though.

Dan:

I mean, right now, I'm very light-headed.

Maureen:

I mean, when are we going to get an election result? April?

Dan:

Maybe.

Maureen:

"Oh my God, we still don't have an election result, we have no president."

Dan:

Oh my God.

Maureen:

"Oh my God, we're all president now."

Dan:

Oh, no.

Maureen:

"Oh my God, Joe Biden is wrestling with Trump." Dan, that debate is still going to be a night of magic for yours truly, I'm going to pop all popcorn. Ah.

Dan:

I actually just read that the Trump campaign wants more debates.

Maureen:

Oh boy.

Dan:

There's a weird Republican gambit happening right now, where they have decided that the... This is true with a number of senators as well, where they are like, "Oh, let's do more debates." I think it was Susan Collins,

Maureen:

Oh.

Dan:

Announced that she wanted to do 16 debates with her-

Maureen:

Susan?

Dan:

... Opponent, including the first one on the day that she issued the letter, saying she wanted to do 16.

Maureen:

I don't even know what that means.

Dan:

Literally was like, "Let's do it right here, right now."

Maureen:

"Come on, we're going to a debate. Come over to my house we're going to talk about policies."

Dan:

I am terrified that that's really what I sound like, just really scared about that fact.

Maureen:

"Oh my God."

Dan:

Oh my God. Oh God.

Maureen:

"It's me, Dan sinker, oh no, oh no."

Dan:

It explains why nobody asks me to host things, oh boy.

Maureen: